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	<title>Comments on: Crime and Punishment</title>
	<link>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141</link>
	<description>Breezing the shoot. Random mutterings of a Web Developer.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:14:46 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: JackP</title>
		<link>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-815</link>
		<author>JackP</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 15:22:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-815</guid>
					<description>Yikes! I think that's going a bit far...

Don't get me wrong, I:
Don't think prison should be a 'soft' option
Think that people are in prison to be punished
Don't think that people in prison should have luxuries that others can't necessarily afford
Think that people in prison should do useful work to minimise (or ideally entirely offset) the cost of keeping them in prison


But I am still kind of in agreement on the 'inhumane' thing. Anyone that forces people to watch Newt Gingrich has to be classed as inhumane... plus I also think that while prison should be about &lt;em&gt;punishment&lt;/em&gt;, it should also be about &lt;em&gt;rehabilitation&lt;/em&gt;: get people to consider the impact of their crimes on others, and equip them with the skills to perform a useful function in society when they get out again. 

Don't forget &lt;a href="http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/info/AMR51/051/1997" rel="nofollow"&gt;Amnesty International's concerns about ill-treatment&lt;/a&gt;.

Don't forget some of the negative sides of the scheme (taken from Wikipedia):

Charles Agster, a mentally handicapped man who was killed in the County Jail shortly after being arrested on misdemeanor loitering charges
Death of Scott Norberg ... evidence suggests detention officers shocked Norberg several times with a stun-gun. According to an investigation by Amnesty International, Norberg was already handcuffed and face down when officers dragged him from his cell and placed him in a restraint chair with a towel covering his face
Brian Crenshaw was a blind inmate allegedly beaten into a coma by guards working under Arpaio ... who later died in hospital
Richard Post was a paraplegic inmate arrested in 1996 for possession of marijuana and criminal trespass. Post was placed in a restraint chair by guards and his neck was broken in the process. The event, caught on video, shows guards smiling and laughing while Post is being injured

I won't be passing it on.

 I think the barbarous, inhumane treatment meted out to prisoner's in Joe's regime is not one we should be celebrating. I don't think we should just unquestioningly swallow the spin dished out by the Sheriff's office (as above).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yikes! I think that&#8217;s going a bit far&#8230;</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t get me wrong, I:<br />
Don&#8217;t think prison should be a &#8217;soft&#8217; option<br />
Think that people are in prison to be punished<br />
Don&#8217;t think that people in prison should have luxuries that others can&#8217;t necessarily afford<br />
Think that people in prison should do useful work to minimise (or ideally entirely offset) the cost of keeping them in prison</p>
<p>But I am still kind of in agreement on the &#8216;inhumane&#8217; thing. Anyone that forces people to watch Newt Gingrich has to be classed as inhumane&#8230; plus I also think that while prison should be about <em>punishment</em>, it should also be about <em>rehabilitation</em>: get people to consider the impact of their crimes on others, and equip them with the skills to perform a useful function in society when they get out again. </p>
<p>Don&#8217;t forget <a href="http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/info/AMR51/051/1997">Amnesty International&#8217;s concerns about ill-treatment</a>.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t forget some of the negative sides of the scheme (taken from Wikipedia):</p>
<p>Charles Agster, a mentally handicapped man who was killed in the County Jail shortly after being arrested on misdemeanor loitering charges<br />
Death of Scott Norberg &#8230; evidence suggests detention officers shocked Norberg several times with a stun-gun. According to an investigation by Amnesty International, Norberg was already handcuffed and face down when officers dragged him from his cell and placed him in a restraint chair with a towel covering his face<br />
Brian Crenshaw was a blind inmate allegedly beaten into a coma by guards working under Arpaio &#8230; who later died in hospital<br />
Richard Post was a paraplegic inmate arrested in 1996 for possession of marijuana and criminal trespass. Post was placed in a restraint chair by guards and his neck was broken in the process. The event, caught on video, shows guards smiling and laughing while Post is being injured</p>
<p>I won&#8217;t be passing it on.</p>
<p> I think the barbarous, inhumane treatment meted out to prisoner&#8217;s in Joe&#8217;s regime is not one we should be celebrating. I don&#8217;t think we should just unquestioningly swallow the spin dished out by the Sheriff&#8217;s office (as above).</p>
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		<title>By: Jaybee</title>
		<link>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-816</link>
		<author>Jaybee</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2008 16:10:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-816</guid>
					<description>Double yikes. I hadn't seen any of the information on the Amnesty site. My first assumption was that you were complaining about the use of chain gangs and pink boxers, both of which I think are a darn good idea.

The problem with all of this is that people go too far. The treatment listed &lt;em&gt;in the post&lt;/em&gt; is reasonable, designed to put people off wanting to re-offend in order to get a cushy life at no cost. OK, I'm not sure I agree with no protection from the heat but I do agree with the no frills approach and saving taxpayer money by not providing luxuries.

Rehabilitation is fine but you tend to get the do-gooders pushing everything in completely the opposite direction to Joe and you end up with &lt;abbr title="Her Majesty's Prison"&gt;H.M.P.&lt;/abbr&gt; Ritz. 

It needs a balance and that's not what we have at the moment.

I'd be interested to see the stats on re-offending from that jail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Double yikes. I hadn&#8217;t seen any of the information on the Amnesty site. My first assumption was that you were complaining about the use of chain gangs and pink boxers, both of which I think are a darn good idea.</p>
<p>The problem with all of this is that people go too far. The treatment listed <em>in the post</em> is reasonable, designed to put people off wanting to re-offend in order to get a cushy life at no cost. OK, I&#8217;m not sure I agree with no protection from the heat but I do agree with the no frills approach and saving taxpayer money by not providing luxuries.</p>
<p>Rehabilitation is fine but you tend to get the do-gooders pushing everything in completely the opposite direction to Joe and you end up with <abbr title="Her Majesty's Prison">H.M.P.</abbr> Ritz. </p>
<p>It needs a balance and that&#8217;s not what we have at the moment.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d be interested to see the stats on re-offending from that jail.</p>
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		<title>By: Neil Oliver</title>
		<link>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-817</link>
		<author>Neil Oliver</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 08:32:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-817</guid>
					<description>it seems to me that people forget prison should serve 3 purposes.
1. Punish the Guilty: by the removal of liberties that the rest of us take for granted.
2. Protect the innocent/Public: by keeping criminals off the streets
3. Facillitate rehabilitation.
Recent exposes of prisons in the former soviet block, South America and parts of Africa show just how bad conditions can get, of course things can get taken to extremes but look where we are today (partly) through lack of corporal punishment in the home and schools.
On a similar topic I don't understand why people seeking political asylum are unhappy about living in an ex army camp while waiting to be processed. After all the conditions they are trying to escape are much worse aren't they and with the threat of imprisonment or worse.

Last thing 42 days detention for terrorist suspects.... with councils now using anti terrorists survellance laws to catch people who let their dogs crap on the footpath how long would it be before people who complain about public transport just get carted off to do their time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>it seems to me that people forget prison should serve 3 purposes.<br />
1. Punish the Guilty: by the removal of liberties that the rest of us take for granted.<br />
2. Protect the innocent/Public: by keeping criminals off the streets<br />
3. Facillitate rehabilitation.<br />
Recent exposes of prisons in the former soviet block, South America and parts of Africa show just how bad conditions can get, of course things can get taken to extremes but look where we are today (partly) through lack of corporal punishment in the home and schools.<br />
On a similar topic I don&#8217;t understand why people seeking political asylum are unhappy about living in an ex army camp while waiting to be processed. After all the conditions they are trying to escape are much worse aren&#8217;t they and with the threat of imprisonment or worse.</p>
<p>Last thing 42 days detention for terrorist suspects&#8230;. with councils now using anti terrorists survellance laws to catch people who let their dogs crap on the footpath how long would it be before people who complain about public transport just get carted off to do their time.</p>
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		<title>By: Adult Ühler</title>
		<link>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-819</link>
		<author>Adult Ühler</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 10:34:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-819</guid>
					<description>As someone reading from the UK, it is really interesting to read this. What you are saying is so different from the dribs and drabs I have picked up from American prisons. I think over here prison is not such a haven.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone reading from the UK, it is really interesting to read this. What you are saying is so different from the dribs and drabs I have picked up from American prisons. I think over here prison is not such a haven.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Cherim</title>
		<link>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-832</link>
		<author>Mike Cherim</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:39:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-832</guid>
					<description>I'd hate it if I were there, but I have to say it sounds like a great program. First the savings for the taxpayers, and then the pure motivation of it. Sounds like quite the deterrent. I must say, though, that the Disney channel will make killers out of the most peace-loving among us so I'm not sure that's a good idea ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d hate it if I were there, but I have to say it sounds like a great program. First the savings for the taxpayers, and then the pure motivation of it. Sounds like quite the deterrent. I must say, though, that the Disney channel will make killers out of the most peace-loving among us so I&#8217;m not sure that&#8217;s a good idea <img src='http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Ginny Scorup</title>
		<link>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-837</link>
		<author>Ginny Scorup</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 06:31:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.jbvisions.co.uk/voices/archives/141#comment-837</guid>
					<description>I AGREE!!!  Way to go, Sheriff! If all prisons were like yours there would be a lot less crime and we would not be in the current position of running out of prison spaces!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I AGREE!!!  Way to go, Sheriff! If all prisons were like yours there would be a lot less crime and we would not be in the current position of running out of prison spaces!</p>
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